It was recently revealed yesterday that none other than Robert Mugabe, President of Zimbabwe has endorsed Dave and the Tories. Maybe they share similar policies?
Max
It was recently revealed yesterday that none other than Robert Mugabe, President of Zimbabwe has endorsed Dave and the Tories. Maybe they share similar policies?
Max
Political opportunism at its very best. To even suggest that there is any link or similarity between Mugabe and Cameron is beyond reproach.
Don’t be ridiculous. You don’t actually believe that’s a serious comment. Sarcastic or ironic perhaps. The issue which is far greater is scope that you conviently deny or most likely are trying to find a way to escape from is the endorsement itself, which is of course indefensible as you’ve already demonstrated.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/mar/04/robert-mugabe-david-cameron-conservatives?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Links between David Cameron and Mugabe there may not be, but there is no denying that Mugabe received very vigorous support from the Conservative government of Margaret Thatcher.
But it is not really a political point because times change but not as much as who are British allies and enemies. In the words of Lord Palmerstone “This country has no permanent friends or perpetual allies only permanent interests”.
Margaret Thatcher recognised Rhodesias right to independence. She upheld the right of the “colonies” as they then were to determine their own future. Mugabe was, in his day, a “good” leader in tune with his people. She was absolutely right to support their bid for independence and Mugabe at that point had not committed the attrocities he would later commit and therefore her support for him was entirely right and justified. To try to imply that the Mugabe of the 1980′s and the Mugabe of the 2000′s are one in the same is completely wrong. In his day Mugabe was like the Mandela of Rhodesia and had Thatcher not supported him the hypocrites on the left that now slam her for that same support would have slammed her then for not supporting this “brave black man trying to liberate his people”. We could not have known how he would turn out.
And Oliver I’m afraid it is you who is being “ridiculous”. Mugabe is NOT endorsing David Cameron per se his motivation is ANYONE BUT LABOUR and if you can’t see that then you’re being pig ignorant. He’d endorse anyone to get rid of Blair or Brown. And even if he were to be actively supporting Cameron he would find soon enough he wouldn’t have a friend in a Conservative led British government so its all a load of old tosh. Civilised society shouldn’t give this man or his views the time of day. To do so is to legitimise him and to make out as if hes a man whose opinion is worth noting. Thats why the “story” wasn’t even carried on alot of the news channels because everyone can see how ridiculous it is.
Also it is interesting to see that this site finds the time to comment on trivial issues such as this but fails to find the time to acknowledge important issues of the day such as the fact your election campaign is being funded by the militant mob known as Unite – an organisation most of the country finds abhorrent. Even Gordon has condemned them (admittedly whilst still taking money from them) so my question is; does BULS have an opinion on the proposed strikes? Or would you rather avoid that one?
“trivial issues”, ok Dan for a start it’s just a bit of a joke and when it comes to “trivial issues” it’s bucf’s blog that has to be leading the way and rarely covers (well now a days anyway) anything of relevence or interest.
If its a joke I don’t get it lol. As for BUCF’s blog, yes theres a bit of a lull lately oweing to essays and deadlines etc but if you compare the respective records of the 2 blogs, since 2005 BUCF has led the way on every front. Lest we forget which society launched the first political blog at Birmingham Uni and who followed suit
“Maybe they share similar policies?”-That’s the joke, we all know they don’t really, just thought it’d be good to have a bit of “Political opportunism at its very best.”.
And yes bucf did set up the blog first but it’s not like anyone who’s in BULS now was there when that happened and so gives a toss on that issue :p lol! But, “BUCF has led the way on every front.” that’s very debatable.
Oh and the bucf blog seems to have been at “a bit of a lull” for some time now, certainly going as far back as Christmas, with nothing on the pre-Budget report for example.
“Unite- an organisation most of the country finds abhorrent”
- Ok. Prove it.
“Margaret Thatcher recognised Rhodesias right to independence. She upheld the right of the “colonies” as they then were to determine their own future. Mugabe was, in his day, a “good” leader in tune with his people. She was absolutely right to support their bid for independence and Mugabe at that point had not committed the attrocities he would later commit and therefore her support for him was entirely right and justified. To try to imply that the Mugabe of the 1980’s and the Mugabe of the 2000’s are one in the same is completely wrong. In his day Mugabe was like the Mandela of Rhodesia and had Thatcher not supported him the hypocrites on the left that now slam her for that same support would have slammed her then for not supporting this “brave black man trying to liberate his people”. We could not have known how he would turn out.”
- That is all largely true, but so what? Mugabe in the 80s may have been a ‘good’ leader whereas he is a big ‘bad’ guy in the 00s. I never said anything to support or contradict that. All I said was, that he was supported by Margaret Thatcher, which is a fact.
“Lest we forget which society launched the first political blog at Birmingham Uni and who followed suit”
- Unless it is your own personal achievement, I think this point is personally irrelevant to the conduct of this debate.
“Even Gordon has condemned them (admittedly whilst still taking money from them) so my question is; does BULS have an opinion on the proposed strikes?”
- If i did not know better you would seem to be inferring that Labour should stop accepting money from people with whom it does not agree on every single issue? Interesting precedent to set.
And to be fair, surely it is healthier to have a government which can be critical of its donors rather than one which is cowed by them into agreeing with things it otherwise would not?
“militant mob known as Unite – an organisation most of the country finds abhorrent.”
Sorry, why exactly are workers asserting their rights abhorrent? Gordon isn’t hot on BA strikes but there’s nothing wrong with the organisation itself.
I wouldn’t worry about it too much, I’m sure he’d reverse all such statements if Unite donated the required sum to his own Party.
“Civilised society shouldn’t give this man or his views the time of day. To do so is to legitimise him and to make out as if hes a man whose opinion is worth noting. Thats why the “story” wasn’t even carried on alot of the news channels because everyone can see how ridiculous it is.”
Interesting when compared to this:
“In December, ZimEye columnist Gilbert Bere predicted that there is a high possibility that a Torie government will betray Zimbabwe’s Movement for Democratic Change party and enter into a secret deal with Mugabe. These views now seemingly confirmed by Mugabe are also widely believed by many Zimbabweans.”
Obviously you’re the kind of guy who’ll say pretty much anything to get out of trouble or detract the discussion from it’s original indefensible point. Fact is, the Conservative Party, not the Liberal Democrats or the Green Party, or UKIP or any of the others, has been endorsed by a genocidal dictator. He chose you.
Also, on a side note, becoming involved in a more diverse range of hobbies would be good for you.
Oliver/Suzy
1) Read almost any publication, watch any news programme and yes talk to anyone in the street and you will find general widespread outrage at the proposed BA strikes and a hostility to the Unite movement. “Abhorrent” might be the wrong word but the suggestion that a majority of people find the BA strikes unjustified and are outraged by the actions of Unite is very true. To give some “weight” to the point can I direct you to a poll published by the Guardian, yes that bastian of left wing politics, that showed 55% of respondents believed that Unite or the Cabin crew themselves were to blame. 27% said the management, 31% said the unions because they had misled their members, 23.9% said the cabin crew were to blame and 17% said all of the above. Now for the Guardian I found that poll pretty shocking. So yes I stand by the point most people are furious with Unite.
2)Im sorry Suzy but “workers asserting their rights” is a romantic notion and you know it. Its like Scargill and the miners – a dilluded insurrectionist forcing the majority of ordinary miners to follow him in to a fight they couldn’t win or they didn’t want to fight. He refused to ballot his members because he knew that less than 50% of the pits were in favour of a strike. Didn’t matter to him – he did it anyway and any one of his own members who refused to be bullied in to a strike and preffered to get out to work were condemned as scabs and class traitors. When really they were honorable men refusing to bow to mob mentality and wanting to put food on their family table. The fact is BA are one of if not the best paid in the industry. They have the kind of perks most other employees in the industry would kill for – I know because I have a friend who works for a rival airline. At a time when their company is in financial trouble they should be pulling behind the management not demanding more off them. It is greed under the guise of “workers rights”. Never confuse the voice and will of the union leadership with the voice and will of the members. Theyre not always one in the same.
3)Don’t be churlish Oliver, you raised Maggie to imply she supported a dictator. Otherwise what possible point would their be to make? Oh a former Prime Minister supported a national black leader 20-30 years ago BEFORE he became a genocidal dictator? Alert the press. You raised her to make a pathetic point and it flopped.
4) A “high possibility that a Torie government will betray Zimbabwe’s Movement for Democratic Change” ooohhh thats a fact then. I’d like to know THEIR source? …Incidently its TORY
5)”Obviously you’re the kind of guy who’ll say pretty much anything to get out of trouble” Im in trouble? News to me lol
6)”Fact is, the Conservative Party, not the Liberal Democrats or the Green Party, or UKIP or any of the others, has been endorsed by a genocidal dictator” Therein lies your ignorance.
7)”Also, on a side note, becoming involved in a more diverse range of hobbies would be good for you.” That shows how little you know and how petty you are
Much Love x
“Read almost any publication, watch any news programme and yes talk to anyone in the street and you will find general widespread outrage at the proposed BA strikes and a hostility to the Unite movement. “Abhorrent” might be the wrong word but the suggestion that a majority of people find the BA strikes unjustified and are outraged by the actions of Unite is very true. To give some “weight” to the point can I direct you to a poll published by the Guardian, yes that bastian of left wing politics, that showed 55% of respondents believed that Unite or the Cabin crew themselves were to blame. 27% said the management, 31% said the unions because they had misled their members, 23.9% said the cabin crew were to blame and 17% said all of the above. Now for the Guardian I found that poll pretty shocking. So yes I stand by the point most people are furious with Unite.”
- There is a difference between disagreeing with someone and finding them abhorrent. Your ability to talk in hyperbole and exaggeration is once again unsurpassed.
“A “high possibility that a Torie government will betray Zimbabwe’s Movement for Democratic Change” ooohhh thats a fact then. I’d like to know THEIR source? …Incidently its TORY”
- And there was you telling me off for pedantry a few weeks ago.
3)Don’t be churlish Oliver, you raised Maggie to imply she supported a dictator. Otherwise what possible point would their be to make? Oh a former Prime Minister supported a national black leader 20-30 years ago BEFORE he became a genocidal dictator? Alert the press. You raised her to make a pathetic point and it flopped.
- I think you will find, that it was I, not Oliver, who made first mention of Maggie Thatcherr. If you want to have a go at someone for making a statement, at least aim at the correct person. I would argue that it did not really flop because I did not make any sweeping statements related to it. Once again (I do wish you would read things properly because I do so hate repeating myself) I merely stated a fact.
6)”Fact is, the Conservative Party, not the Liberal Democrats or the Green Party, or UKIP or any of the others, has been endorsed by a genocidal dictator” Therein lies your ignorance.
- Please explain how it highlight Mr Jackson’s ignorance, or is that, once again, just unsubstantiated dribble.
5)”Obviously you’re the kind of guy who’ll say pretty much anything to get out of trouble” Im in trouble? News to me lol
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/mar/18/william-hague-2000-lord-ashcroft-tax-status
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/mar/17/unions-attack-democracy-unite-ba
“…“workers asserting their rights” is a romantic notion…a dilluded insurrectionist… He refused to ballot his members because he knew that less than 50% of the pits were in favour of a strike. It is greed under the guise of “workers rights”.”
Basically, you don’t really believe in workers’ rights and you think union barons still lead the worker class on an anarchistic rampage? Unite did have a ballot, twice, actually and last I heard were having talks into the night to try to and solve the dispute as the you likely well know, so your comparsion is somewhat considerably weakened by these facts. And wasn’t “greed” the whole point of Thatcherism? Oh no that was middle class greed, I do beg your pardon.
“Therein lies your ignorance.”
Go on…
“That shows how little you know and how petty you are.”
Or a reaction formation defence mechanism response to our passionate and undying love for one another, no doubt resulting in the occurrence of some sort of never ending, but strangely erotic, mind game if we ever actually met. Yes…that’s probably it, especially after that “sarcastic” “Much love x” at the end of your writing (which wasn’t really sarcastic at all – classical denial/rationalisation).
Oh man, Oliver! If you like it(him) that much then you’d really better put a ring on it(him).
No can do. Firstly, all that stuff takes place in the unconscious, so, on a conscious level I’m (we’re) unaware of any of the aforementioned thought processes due to repression, which happens without my (our) knowledge. Secondly, the UK doesn’t yet have gay marriage and I’d therefore have to oppose you’re suggestion both on principle and in order to avoid what I’d perceive to be patronisation by the state and others.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8576984.stm
Must say, I think this guy is barking.
SARCASTIC “Much Love”??? Oh Oliver. Im hurt. That went deep that one. Excuse me while I go and weep in the foetal position lol